Prince and Karen Carpenter

[kc1950]

I recently read this in a Prince-fan magazine and found it funny-
Alan Leeds was Prince's road manager and relayed this story in a Prince fanzine called "COntroversey."

Prince wrote Stand-Back for Stevie Nicks in LA in late 1982. He was always on the look-out for songs for female artist he admired - Prince recorded a lot of stuff in LA at Sunset Sound. So, he asked Stevie if she knew the Carpenters. Stevie said she didn't but her friend was Sherwin Brash's personal assistant.

Long-story short - Prince was a big Carpenters fan and loved her voice. He told Stevie Nicks if she could get into contact with the manager and then Karen. Sadly, It never worked out and kind of fell through. By mid 1982 - she was in NY and then of course she died soon after.

Apparently - Prince wrote two songs with Karen Carpenter in mind - one was called "Sugar Walls" which was written around 1982 and recorded later by Sheena Easton

- Lol - i wonder how Karen Carpenter would have recorded that -

Leeds said the other song was a work in progress which was called Manic Monday and written with Karen in mind. It was later clean-up and lyrics re-done was given to the bangles and was called "Manic Monday" - and i think it would have been perfect for Karen.

Who knows? It would have been interesting - Imagine -Karen Carpenter singing 'U Got the look" many years later - LOL!!

I mean talk about opposites - but then again Prince is very into Joni Mitchell and other singers who one normally wouldn't put into Prince's category.

I don't think Karen would be good singing 'Glamorous Life" - LOL

[Rick Henry]

This is very interesting. I've never heard this one. I have a few connects in the Prince world and will dig up further information on this.

Karen and Prince on the surface may seem like opposites but really upon listening to Karen's solo album she incorporated many elements of funk/jazz/R&B and disco into her music the same elements which drive Prince's music.

I never cared for the song "Sugar Walls" although had Karen recorded it I probably would love it. "Manic Monday" is a great upbeat pop song which would have fit quite well on Karen's solo record.

[jill]

Prince has actually written over 40 hits for other people. A lot of people think he wrote "Nothing compares 2 U" for Sinead O'Connor who sang it in 1990, but he actually wrote it for The Family in 1985, for their debut album. He released it himself in 1993 singing a live duet with Rosie Gaines, having rearranged it a more soulful sound.

I personally think he is a brilliant writer, and had he had the chance, he would have written something that would have suited Karen, down to the ground.

Jill.

[enigma]

I am not a huge Prince fan but I do acknowledge him as a genius as Jill said he has written countless songs for artists of various musical styles and backgrounds some quite different from Princes' own and they still sound good and alot are hits. Thats the sign of a truely gifted and great song writer no matter who records produces and arranges your songs they still turn into good finished songs. I have never heard of the connection to Karen but he would be a great song writer to turn to for Karens solo projects or even future Carpenter projects had Karen lived. Rick I hope you can research this and varify this I believe it but it does seem too good to be true. If it is true imagine the possibilities with that team even for the odd song...wow!

[kc1950]

Yep - Prince always wrote for other artists : stevie nicks, sinead o'connor, miles davis, and Paula Abdul.

The Carpenter connection was through Stevie nicks. He wrote the song "Stand Back" for her or co-wrote it - and that's the connection.

also - Prince wrote songs for Mavis Staples and always was inspired when he wrote i.e. He wrote Adore thinking of Luther Vandross, he wrote Little Red Corvette after hearing a John Lennon song.

The Bangles song is written by Alexander Nevermind but its really Prince and all the Sheila E stuff -

I have heard he was a big Joni Mitchell fan but i was surprised he liked Karen's voice - The guy who mentioned the inspiration and the near hook-up was Alan Leeds - . He was a road manager for Paisely Park and later for James Brown. Alan's ' brother - Eric Leeds was in the group "the family" which is where the original song "Nothing compares to u" Eric Leeds played on a lot of prince stuff and is in Sign of the times video.

Prince wrote a lot of stuff that i could see Karen Carpenter doing "Do U lie" from Parade, "Condiiton of the Heart" from around the world in a day. "starfish and coffee" from sign of the times. he is an artist who touches broad areas of music and always had a strong feminine influence in his music

Anyway - Prince later did a lot of work with Joni Mitchell in collobarating on songs and hanging out and later worked with Sheena Easton and Sheila E -

[Rick Henry]

Jan 28, 2009 9:27:33 GMT -5 enigma said:

I am not a huge Prince fan but I do acknowledge him as a genius as Jill said he has written countless songs for artists of various musical styles and backgrounds some quite different from Princes' own and they still sound good and alot are hits. Thats the sign of a truely gifted and great song writer no matter who records produces and arranges your songs they still turn into good finished songs. I have never heard of the connection to Karen but he would be a great song writer to turn to for Karens solo projects or even future Carpenter projects had Karen lived. Rick I hope you can research this and varify this I believe it but it does seem too good to be true. If it is true imagine the possibilities with that team even for the odd song...wow!

I will also give Prince his credit due. The guy is a true musical genius in every sense of the word. Like you E I am not a huge fan of Prince.

What's remarkable about Prince is that on many of his albums he writes all the song, produces, arranges and plays all the instruments as well as doing all the vocals and he does an excellent job in putting it all together. He is amazing.

I have found some information on this...

First Prince never wrote any songs for Stevie Nicks. The song "Stand Back" was written and composed solely by Stevie Nicks herself. Stevie Nicks wrote "Stand Back" after hearing the Prince song "Little Red Corvette" and based parts of the song on the Prince song. Nicks and Prince met only one time and it was a very brief meeting. After the tracks for "Stand Back" had been laid down, Nicks called Prince and told him of her inspiration for the song and he came to the studio and added the throbbing synth bass and the pingy keyboard flourishes on the chorus. Prince finished his parts then just walked out of the studio and and as Nicks said in an MTV episode of "Storyteller", "out of my life".

I will come back with more info as I get it.

[kc1950]

I think he did get a co-write credit on that - my understanding was she had a hard-time doing keys on it and he came in and did in like ten minutes -

i thought it was a co-written but you may be right - i thought they were a little closer than that -

Prince is awesome -

I thought stevie and him spent a lot of time at sunset sound - when both were recording there in early 80's - i know stevie loved that studio -

interesting when two great artists meet like that - I know one thing Prince and Richard Carpenter wouldn't have gotten along

[Rick Henry]

Jan 28, 2009 11:12:48 GMT -5 kc1950 said:

I think he did get a co-write credit on that - my understanding was she had a hard-time doing keys on it and he came in and did in like ten minutes -

i thought it was a co-written but you may be right - i thought they were a little closer than that -

Prince is awesome -

I thought stevie and him spent a lot of time at sunset sound - when both were recording there in early 80's - i know stevie loved that studio -

interesting when two great artists meet like that - I know one thing Prince and Richard Carpenter wouldn't have gotten along

The songwriting credit for "Stand Back" lists only Stevie Nicks. As a matter of fact Prince is not even credited for his bass and keyboard parts on the song.

In the liner notes to her TimeSpace album, Nicks explained: "I got married the day I wrote this song. We were driving to Santa Barbara and a new song by Prince came on, so we pulled over somewhere and got the tape. It just gave me an incredible idea, so I spent many hours that night writing a song about some kind of a crazy argument, and it was to become one of the most important of my songs. I've been doing this song for years, Fleetwood Mac does it also, and I never get tired of it. Stand Back has always been my favorite song onstage because when it starts, it has an energy that comes from somewhere unknown and it seems to have no timespace. I've never quite understood this sound, but I have NEVER questioned it.

I become a different person, and I like that, because usually I make up my OWN characters, but the lady in Stand Back was not my idea. By the way, Prince did come into the studio the night I called him and told him about the song, and he played incredible synthesizer on it. And then he just walked out of my life, and I didn't see him for a long time. It was extraordinary."

[kc1950]

that's great inside information - i didn't know stevie nicks liked stand back so much - it is a good song -


little red corvette was big around late 1982 when 1999 came out so interesting stuff -

i think stevie's marriage was worse than karen's - sadly

[kc1950]

Bacharach and David could written new songs for Karen too - that would have been cool

Also - i think KC would have benefited from song-writers like Diane Warren and folks like that -

And who knows - we could have seen Karen do duets with Frank Sinatra, TOny benett

and don't forget - Karen Carpenter could have worked for David Foster and people like that

Phenomenal possibilities

I always picture in my mind singing "Head over heels" by Tears for Fears - i don't know why - but they would have been a good one -

Her cover of Song for u is good - but Donny Hathaway's version is incredible

[Rick Henry]

Jan 28, 2009 10:39:59 GMT -5 kc1950 said:

I have heard he was a big Joni Mitchell fan but i was surprised he liked Karen's voice - The guy who mentioned the inspiration and the near hook-up was Alan Leeds - . He was a road manager for Paisely Park and later for James Brown. Alan's ' brother - Eric Leeds was in the group "the family" which is where the original song "Nothing compares to u" Eric Leeds played on a lot of prince stuff and is in Sign of the times video.

Prince wrote a lot of stuff that i could see Karen Carpenter doing "Do U lie" from Parade, "Condiiton of the Heart" from around the world in a day. "starfish and coffee" from sign of the times. he is an artist who touches broad areas of music and always had a strong feminine influence in his music

Anyway - Prince later did a lot of work with Joni Mitchell in collobarating on songs and hanging out and later worked with Sheena Easton and Sheila E -

Just to get our facts correct...

Yes, Prince is a big fan of Joni Mitchell (as I am myself... she has a fantastic voice). although as far as collaborating on songs and hanging out this did not happen. Prince and Joni never did any work together at all. The extent of their professional work includes one song which Prince wrote for Joni, which she rejected and never recorded.

Here is a comment which Joni made regarding the song:
Straight from the Joni biography, Shadows and Light:
Prince recorded a song for her, a ballad with the curious title, "Emotional Pump." Mitchell declined to use the song, considering it not in her style. 'I called him up and said "I can't sing this." He's a strange little duck, but I like him.'



Regarding the songs "Sugar Walls" and "Manic Monday" were actually written for Vanity in late 1982 and early 1983 and were to be included on an album she was recording at that time. The songs ended up not making it onto the final product.