|
|
Post by wisejester7 on May 4, 2007 12:17:04 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by YesterdayOnceMore on May 7, 2007 21:01:20 GMT -5
 Hmmmmm..........THIS ought to be interesting! Thanks for providing this link, Wj7! I'll come back with my thoughts on it.
Tim 
|
|
|
|
Post by smoothie2 on May 9, 2007 23:47:54 GMT -5
 THANKS for the link Wj...I have been watching a great deal lately on you-tube and did see some of the wedding part but not what you found. To hear the music and watch all that is really special. It's sad tho of course, looking at it and knowing how it turned out, but I really think Karen and Tom loved each other and really wanted it to work. Probably Karen being the main one wanting that more than the rest of her family. as in other clips, Richard is smiling, but a bit strained. He wants the best for her, but just is doubtful about how it would affect their careers. as far as Karen being happy, she, like so very many brides are in their own beautiful dream.
|
|
Dave
Ultra Emissary 
"sleeping in the arms of the cosmos..."
Posts: 1,515
|
Post by Dave on May 10, 2007 11:20:33 GMT -5
My initial thought was a technical one...how can the recording be so "clean", without the hiss from magnetic tape? Digital recording did not exist in 1980. But today, someone cleaned it up, I suppose. It still seems like a lot of effort.
The feeling I got was that the ceremony seemed like less of a ceremony and more like a show.
Another set of questions to ask is where did this recording come from? How did they get it? Why put it on YouTube now?
Yeah, I'm a bit skeptical about a lot of things, and it doesn't hurt to ask questions. Some of the comments on YouTube seem to have come from people who are only now beginning the learning curve, and they are at about where I was three years ago, so I can't be too critical.
|
|
|
|
Post by wisejester7 on May 11, 2007 10:27:22 GMT -5
My initial thought was a technical one...how can the recording be so "clean", without the hiss from magnetic tape? Digital recording did not exist in 1980. But today, someone cleaned it up, I suppose. It still seems like a lot of effort. The feeling I got was that the ceremony seemed like less of a ceremony and more like a show. Another set of questions to ask is where did this recording come from? How did they get it? Why put it on YouTube now? Yeah, I'm a bit skeptical about a lot of things, and it doesn't hurt to ask questions. Some of the comments on YouTube seem to have come from people who are only now beginning the learning curve, and they are at about where I was three years ago, so I can't be too critical. Yes, this was an interesting find for me, as well. I was amazed and more than curious about this audio turning up ... and so 'clean' of sound. Where has this been? Who released it ... and why? First impression: Tom didn't sound sincere ... maybe he was nervous. |
|
|
|
Post by YesterdayOnceMore on May 11, 2007 14:23:01 GMT -5
And so, today - I listened, and watched the pieces flash by. SO fascinating, and to me, quite sad. What a sham this marriage was....and it seems obvious to me from listening here - Tom sounds so "show-offish" and Karen sounds well, I don't think angry is the right word, but perhaps a bit too serious, or at the very least, a bit unsure. Maybe it's like you said, wj7, and perhaps both were nervous. From the photos, even, I get the idea that Tom Burris looked like this was something he "had to do." I don't think it looks like many of the Carpenter family liked him, or fancied the idea of Karen getting married at all. They never liked Richard's suitors, after all. Oh well, I'm sure no one expected such negativity about this from me, but this is how it comes across. Maybe it's all because of everything I've read about this marriage since it happened.....perhaps had I witnessed this or something like it before they ever talked of splitting up, well, I might have made something totally different of the whole thing - like - oh, Karen was nervous, and Tom was so cute the way he said " I DO...and I WILL" - but I doubt it (as Barbosa said to Capt'n Jack Sparrow). Just don't know. Very, VERY interesting. Thanks. Tim Now forum members, don't HATE ME cause I have an opinion here....and probably NOT the opinion you all share-but this is what I think, so I wanted to share it. Okay...carry on.   |
|
|
|
Post by smoothie2 on May 11, 2007 23:27:38 GMT -5
And so, today - I listened, and watched the pieces flash by. SO fascinating, and to me, quite sad. What a sham this marriage was....and it seems obvious to me from listening here - Tom sounds so "show-offish" and Karen sounds well, I don't think angry is the right word, but perhaps a bit too serious, or at the very least, a bit unsure. Maybe it's like you said, wj7, and perhaps both were nervous. From the photos, even, I get the idea that Tom Burris looked like this was something he "had to do." I don't think it looks like many of the Carpenter family liked him, or fancied the idea of Karen getting married at all. They never liked Richard's suitors, after all. Oh well, I'm sure no one expected such negativity about this from me, but this is how it comes across. Maybe it's all because of everything I've read about this marriage since it happened.....perhaps had I witnessed this or something like it before they ever talked of splitting up, well, I might have made something totally different of the whole thing - like - oh, Karen was nervous, and Tom was so cute the way he said " I DO...and I WILL" - but I doubt it (as Barbosa said to Capt'n Jack Sparrow). Just don't know. Very, VERY interesting. Thanks. Tim Now forum members, don't HATE ME cause I have an opinion here....and probably NOT the opinion you all share-but this is what I think, so I wanted to share it. Okay...carry on. ::)Tim, no I don't think anyone would ever hate you around these parts...in fact i tend to agree and i think others will too. by the way, who is Barbosa and Capt. Jack? |
|
|
|
Post by Rick Henry on May 12, 2007 0:38:17 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by GoodOldDreams on May 12, 2007 11:25:30 GMT -5
With the shelving of her solo album and her struggles with anorexia at the time, Karen perhaps hoped her marriage to Tom Burris would realize a life long dream of having her own family and lessen her feelings of disappointment from these major professional and personal setbacks. In a radio interview, Karen acknowledged how people in the public eye such as herself would have to be careful about whom they date because of the possible lure of fame or money rather than true love as the motivation of the suitors. Coming across as suave, polished and successful, Tom was one of few men who appealed to Karen right from first glance. However, beneath this carefully constructed flashy exterior there seemed to be more deception and manipulation than real substance. Some people who went to the wedding noted how "big" this event was and how much of a "show" it was. With this marriage ultimately turning into impending divorce on the day Karen died, it is heartbreaking now to hear their reciting of the traditional vows "... for better or worse... in sickness and in health... to love and to cherish... 'til death do us part..." in this audio clip. To the shock and dismay of those who were there, Tom allegedly cast off his wedding ring in disgust at Karen's funeral. Perhaps it was no coincidence that the song "This Masquerade" was used to characterize the relationship between Karen and Tom in more than one account of Karen's life story.
|
|
|
|
Post by smoothie2 on May 12, 2007 23:17:08 GMT -5
;)Interesting thoughts ...sounds more and more like it seemed to be the thing to do at the time for Karen ...and i wonder why Tom would throw
his wedding ring off at her funeral...a display...of anger no doubt,
and great disappointment...which just seems to fit into that scenario
perfectly if his ultimate goal of the whole thing was to mostly benefit his own fame...hmmmm
Yes, a documentary about their marriage woould surely be interesting.
|
|
Dave
Ultra Emissary
"sleeping in the arms of the cosmos..."
Posts: 1,515
|
Post by Dave on May 18, 2007 18:41:47 GMT -5
Captains Barbossa and Jack Sparrow are the main characters from "Pirates of the Caribbean", Smoothie.
I agree with Tim's description because it's so similar to what happened to my sister in 1972.
My past three years of research has shown me that the Carpenter family's dynamics were quite similar to what I experienced, perhaps it was because their parents and mine were of the same age group. My father was a passive, blue-collar steelworker, while my mother was quite controlling and domineering.
My sister eloped while in college to avoid having to return home after graduation. Her "marriage" lasted 30 years before she decided to stop living a lie. She really did not love her husband, he was just a way to escape our mother.
When it was my turn to go to college, my dad wanted me to go to school in Phoenix, but I wanted to go to Columbus because it was closer to home. For many years I never understood why he didn't want me to come home on weekends (it was only 200 miles away) and many years later I figured out why. He wanted me away from Mom's domineering influence.
By the way, whatever DID happen to Mr. Burris? A Google search turns up more information on me that it does on him. It's almost as if he dropped off the planet.
And don't be so quick to judge his actions...none of us has walked a foot, let alone a mile, in those shoes. Anorexics, like substance abusers, are far from being the easiest people to live with.
|
|
|
|
Post by Rick Henry on May 18, 2007 18:53:43 GMT -5
And don't be so quick to judge his actions...none of us has walked a foot, let alone a mile, in those shoes. Anorexics, like substance abusers, are far from being the easiest people to live with. |
|
Dave
Ultra Emissary
"sleeping in the arms of the cosmos..."
Posts: 1,515
|
Post by Dave on May 19, 2007 5:58:07 GMT -5
...and the worst part of it is that we are left to attempt to figure out what people were thinking when they did certain things. But let's go into "rewind" a bit, and perhaps we might find some clues.
I watched the "Hollywood True Story" on YouTube. It was quite informative. It mentioned that Karen had moved in with Terry, and that it lasted an entire week before she moved back out. That segment inspired me to see if Paula Abdul's "Opposites Attract" was on YouTube, because that's all I could think of. In the end, they were fundamentally incompatible.
Then there was her relationship with "Softly", which as everyone knows was sabotaged by the "inner circle". But they seemed to be compatible.
Suddenly, it's 1980, she's the big Three-Oh, and the biological clock's ticking is beginning to increase in volume. A convenient marriage of financial equals takes place after a mere six months, and while it sometimes works well, the odds are heavily skewed in the direction of failure.
"I think Burris was upset for several reasons... one could be that he saw what was happening to her first hand and just was not able to help her.
He could have possibly been thinking, as he tossed the ring into her casket... "she just wouldn't listen... there was no getting through to her... now look where she is..."
I believe that you have hit the nail squarely on its head, Rick. Frustration borne of daily arguments fueled by his observations of her anorexic lifestyle would eventually push anyone to just walk away, if for no other reason than to retain what shreds of sanity one had left.
Part of what we feel is that we only know *of* Karen and Richard through their performances, but none of us know what type of persons they really are (were). There is a saying that we become our parents, and perhaps Karen attempted to emulate Agnes' influence over the family with Tom, and he wasn't having any of it.
But she did get along with John, but that was five years earlier. I'd wager serious money (maybe $20) that she and John could have made it work...but I bet low!
|
|
|
|
Post by YesterdayOnceMore on May 19, 2007 20:19:28 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by BethMosior on May 31, 2007 19:12:08 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by BethMosior on May 31, 2007 19:25:53 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by wisejester7 on May 31, 2007 20:40:42 GMT -5
|
|
THANX Wisejester7 for the info 
I really loved hearing that 
I really loved it when Karen giggled near the end sooooo cute, it brought much joy to my heart sure wish it lasted 
