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Post by abbafanusa on Jan 30, 2007 21:54:13 GMT -5
Hey! This may seem a little morbid of a question, but does anyone know which magazine/newspaper article it was where the reviewer referred to Karen as Richards "chubby sister" that 'supposedly' started Karens path to anorexia. I'm assuming it was for their Offering album. Has this ever made an appearance on any site? I've just always been curious to read it.
PEPE
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Post by Rick Henry on Jan 30, 2007 23:52:45 GMT -5
 Hi PEPE...
If you're referring to the one which Karen mentions in the TV movie. That does not exist. In the movie Karen was reading a review from Billboard magazine for the single "Close To You". The actual review never made any mention about Karen being chubby. That was one of those changes (add ins) which Richard says was put in for dramatic license. Richard claims this was done quite a bit throughout the movie - to add drama to the story. For this and other reasons Richard claims he does not care for the movie.
I'm still waiting for a big screen movie which focuses more on the person of Karen Carpenter and really digs into what made her click. I can dream can't I? |
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Post by YesterdayOnceMore on Jan 31, 2007 9:08:46 GMT -5
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Post by wisejester7 on Jan 31, 2007 9:46:46 GMT -5
Pipe dreams, Gentlemen. Boy, do I wish a movie of Karen or the Carpenters to be a reality. Like you, Tim, I think that if the movie steered away from the tragedy aspect of Karen it would be just fine. Who would play the major roles ... Karen, Richard, Herb, etc  |
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Post by Ming on Jan 31, 2007 11:04:38 GMT -5
 I'm there with you in that dream, Rick...I'd love to see another movie, this time something that really portrays Karen Carpenter for the "true" person she was. It wouldn't even have to deal with all the "tragedy" that Karen went through. It could be done a number of ways. However it was done, it would certainly be a great movie, with lots of Carpenter music in it, IF Richard gave his nod of approval. This may very well be why nothing else HAS yet to be made, eh? Tim I agree. There should be another movie.  Ming |
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Post by enigma on Jan 31, 2007 16:45:55 GMT -5
I do recall in a carpenters documentary mention of a concert review where Karen was referred to as Richards chubby little sister apparently the reviewer gave the concert a good review and mentioned that as sort of and after thought and Karen became upset when reading this. The documentary pointed out that Karen focused on the chubby sister remark and forgot the praise that was given in the review and theorized it may have been things like this that caused Karens ED (I don't completely agree). It seems to have occcured but not in context of the Close to you single it was apparently a concert review Karen read after a live performance around the same period.   |
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Post by wisejester7 on Jan 31, 2007 21:29:57 GMT -5
I do recall in a carpenters documentary mention of a concert review where Karen was referred to as Richards chubby little sister apparently the reviewer gave the concert a good review and mentioned that as sort of and after thought and Karen became upset when reading this. The documentary pointed out that Karen focused on the chubby sister remark and forgot the praise that was given in the review and theorized it may have been things like this that caused Karens ED (I don't completely agree). It seems to have occcured but not in context of the Close to you single it was apparently a concert review Karen read after a live performance around the same period. I, too, thought there was an actual 'chubby' type of comment made about Karen. |
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Dave
Ultra Emissary 
"sleeping in the arms of the cosmos..."
Posts: 1,515
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Post by Dave on Jan 31, 2007 22:00:04 GMT -5
Legend has it that it was a Philadelphia newspaper columnist who the comment is attributed to.
But there were other things, such as Karen wanting to elope with Terry in 1972, the discovery of the affair by her parents and his subsequent dismissal, that may have set her on that path.
I get the impression from Richard that he'd just like the whole thing to be lost in the sands of time...no movies, no music, nothing.
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Post by smoothie2 on Feb 1, 2007 0:59:03 GMT -5
gee...if there could be a big screen version would be wonderful and I think it would do
very well especially since "docu-dramas" or "biopics" movies are
very popular these days: ("Ray", "I Walk the Line", "Bobby", Dreamgirls etc., "The Queen",
etc.) Interesting about the chubby sister article if there was one.
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Post by Rick Henry on Feb 1, 2007 3:21:51 GMT -5
In the recent interview I did with author/editor Randy Schmidt he commented that it was not Karen who was referred to as chubby - but it was Richard.
Here is a direct statement which Randy made in the interview:
"I absolutely love the Lester Bangs review from an early concert in San Diego - "The Carpenters and the Creeps" it's called! He was one of MANY rock critics sent to review a concert that was anything but rock. He obviously didn't get what was going on musically so he was left to make fun of the audience, their clothes and the Middle America homes from which they came. It is in this article that Richard is referred to as being "chubby" - a lot of people think Billboard called Karen "chubby" but according to Richard, it was part of Hollywood's dramatization for the TV movie." |
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Post by enigma on Feb 1, 2007 10:25:58 GMT -5
Thats interesting Rick everywhere I have read eludes to this Billboard article as calling Karen Richards chubby little sister I guess it fit the ED scenerio so they went with it and did not research to find if Billboard actually said that. I guess its as Richard said don't believe everything you read. I wonder if Rick you can obtain a copy of the original review or get a link to it so we all can read it for ourselves exactly as it was written. Thanks for clearing that up Rick. Dave I agree there are so many other things besides a review or comment that led to Karens ED I think you may have a good reason with what you said for Karens journey towards her Ed. One comment or article does not make an ED it is a progressive process with so many factors and causes. Good point Dave. |
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Post by Rick Henry on Feb 1, 2007 11:24:20 GMT -5
Enigma... the article is on page 37 in Randy Schmidt's book. It was written by the famed Lester Bangs in late 1970 (but was in an early 1971 issue of Rolling Stone Magazine) and is called "Carpenters and the Creeps".
Out of respect to Randy Schmidt (as he paid royalties to publish the article) I will only post portions of the article. The entire article can be read by purchasing his book called: "Yesterday Once More: Memories of the Carpenters and Their Music".
"The first thing is that Karen Carpenter not only sings lead but also plays drums - she's pretty d**n good, too, seldom falters - but singing from behind that massive set she just doesn't give you much to look at, lovely and outgoing as she is. This band should invest in a drummer."
"Brother Richard plays piano, and he's excellent technically, if not emotionally, ripping out crisp though somewhat stereotyped demi-jazz lines that even managed to save an otherwise awkward version of "Nowadays Clancy Can't Even Sing". But watching him... he was a chubby, rather nervous fellow with a round face, pudding bowl hair and a white suit with vast lapels."
As we see the Lester Bangs actually compliments Karen's appearance - but isn't quite so kind to Richard.
I'm just wondering if this article is what made Richard and A&M realize they needed to get Karen out from behind the drums.
For those interested in purchasing a copy of the book here is a direct link:
CLICK HERE: Yesterday Once More: Memories of the Carpenters and Their Music |
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Post by GoodOldDreams on Feb 1, 2007 21:32:20 GMT -5
...Thats interesting Rick everywhere I have read eludes to this Billboard article as calling Karen Richards chubby little sister I guess it fit the ED scenerio so they went with it and did not research to find if Billboard actually said that. I guess its as Richard said don't believe everything you read. I wonder if Rick you can obtain a copy of the original review or get a link to it so we all can read it for ourselves exactly as it was written. Thanks for clearing that up Rick. Dave I agree there are so many other things besides a review or comment that led to Karens ED I think you may have a good reason with what you said for Karens journey towards her Ed. One comment or article does not make an ED it is a progressive process with so many factors and causes. Good point Dave. Unintended humor of the day: In my corner of the world, media-wise, the acronym "ED" is more commonly used nowadays to euphemistically refer to a type of male dysfunction rather than to "eating disorder." Imagine the initial confusion and double entendres conjured up when I first read your post! LOL! Ed |
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Post by enigma on Feb 2, 2007 7:43:46 GMT -5
...Thats interesting Rick everywhere I have read eludes to this Billboard article as calling Karen Richards chubby little sister I guess it fit the ED scenerio so they went with it and did not research to find if Billboard actually said that. I guess its as Richard said don't believe everything you read. I wonder if Rick you can obtain a copy of the original review or get a link to it so we all can read it for ourselves exactly as it was written. Thanks for clearing that up Rick. Dave I agree there are so many other things besides a review or comment that led to Karens ED I think you may have a good reason with what you said for Karens journey towards her Ed. One comment or article does not make an ED it is a progressive process with so many factors and causes. Good point Dave. Unintended humor of the day: In my corner of the world, media-wise, the acronym "ED" is more commonly used nowadays to euphemistically refer to a type of male dysfunction rather than to "eating disorder." Imagine the initial confusion and double entendres conjured up when I first read your post! LOL! Ed lol just to ad my own humour here I know Karen was a tomboy and never really knew Karen but I think I can safely say she did not have that ED and all the viagra in the world would not have helped Karen lol, I never realised the other meaning for the acronym it does make my post more entertaining. Thanks Ed I got a good laugh rereading my post with your anacronym inserted lol. |
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Post by enigma on Feb 2, 2007 7:55:01 GMT -5
Rick it may have been a factor but Richard was under pressure from A&M and some of the people around him to have Karen get out from behind the drums and he initially resisted but gave it after a year or two of this pressure. I guess Karens popularity was eviodent from day one and the pressure was on from then on. One thing that struck me in your post was the criticism of Richard I wonder if Karen was upset at the article being hard on Richard after all she was his biggest fan and supporter so it could not have set well with Karen (or any of the Carpenter family namely Agnes) when the article criticised Richard. Just something that occured to me. BTW Rick I compliment your conviction when sharing copyrighted materials and thanks to you and Randy for sharing the portion of the article. |
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Post by Rick Henry on Feb 2, 2007 11:11:14 GMT -5
Enigma, interesting thought on how Karen and family must have felt about Lester Bangs putting Richard's appearance down. I know if it were my own brother I would have been very upset. I believe Richard took it all with a grain of salt.
As for Karen stepping out from her drums. Yes, I feel it was a move which needed to be made - after all Karen was the focal point of the group and she was certainly an attractive lady. at the same point having a female drummer who sings simultaneously was a factor which made Carpenters unique.
All in all I can understand why they employed a drummer for the live concerts - but why for their recordings? Karen was an excellent drummer - and she should have been playing drums on every song on every one of those albums. The work she did on both the "Ticket To Ride" (Offering) and "Now And Then" albums was fantastic. I see no reason as to why they needed a session drummer (as excellent as they were - Hal Blaine, Jim Gordon, etc) on the recordings. |
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Post by wisejester7 on Feb 2, 2007 19:48:34 GMT -5
I, too, don't understand why Karen didn't play at the recording sessions all the time. She was a fantastic percussionist!
One of the reasons given by the powers that be stated they wanted someone else to play the trap set for pure "power". They brought up that Karen simply couldn't put enough muscle into the drums for the sound they wanted.
In a recording studio they could manipulate Karen's drum tracks until they were 'pushed forward' in the mix to just the right place.
I am left to wonder what was going on. Why did Karen get pushed almost totally out of the throne when she obviously loved playing those skins?
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Post by smoothie2 on Feb 4, 2007 16:40:08 GMT -5
 ;Dthanks Rick for the article...really interesting twist on things....yes, I'm sure Karen would be upset by such
a comment....and yes, she would have done just so wonderfully
well with her usual enthusiasm on drums for all the recordings.
.........I can easily understand how all the factors the troubles
"inside and out" in the world of R. and K. ...success, family
pressures, media pressures....would make Karen feel or anyone, feel out of control....so
working out at a gym or home...dieting...
these were things no one else but Karen could control...
until all of it went way over the top...and she fought
for many yrs. against all of that.
My oh my....
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