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Post by Rick Henry on Dec 28, 2005 0:20:13 GMT -5
 Karen and Richard took the backup and harmony vocal part of a song to a level nobody else had ever done before. They have created some of the most beautiful and chilling backing vocals ever in music history.
Which backing or harmony vocals do you feel are the best by Carpenters / Karen solo?
There's a lot to chose from. |
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Post by Ming on Dec 28, 2005 3:03:04 GMT -5
I think it is Close to You.
Ming
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Post by makapip on Dec 29, 2005 0:39:47 GMT -5
I like the "We've Only Just Begun" 1980 Medley on disk 4 Essential Collection . The part when "We Smiiiiiiiiiiiiiiilllllle" is so rich and thick - that's the best, i really like it, never get tired of hearing it. I think that is why I like the Carpenter's sound so much.  |
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Post by YesterdayOnceMore on Dec 29, 2005 1:07:30 GMT -5
 It's very late on Wednesday night, or early on Thursday morning, but this thread immediately caught my attention as this is one of the things I so dearly love about Carpenters music - the backing vocals. The wonderful tight, smooth, exceptionally well blended vocal background harmonies. Which is my favorite? Hmmmmm.....I'm going to have to give this one some thought so I can come back with a really well written post. There are many beautiful songs that have so much impact and give me that chill factor, not only because of KC's awesome lead vocal, but DUE to the backing vocal arrangements. But I can tell you right off the bat that if we're talking about Karen's solo effort, If I Had You comes immediately to mind for me. That vocal, and the vocal for Lib DeVitto's favorite "Remember When Lovin Took All Night" both have some unbelievably difficult and massive background vocal parts to them that of course KC did all by herself. Not only are they absolutely stunningly beautiful, they are exactly together, and quite difficult to have done, I'm sure, considering the chord structures she sings. Well, like I said, in terms of Carpenters, much more to come from me on this one. Great topic, Rick. Tim 
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Post by Rick Henry on Dec 29, 2005 2:08:19 GMT -5
I have to go with Tim on Karen solo easily "If I Had You" is an outstanding vocal with it's excellent vocal weaving at the end. That has to be one of the best vocal mixes I've ever heard. I also like the harmony vocals Karen sings on "Guess I Just Lost My Head".
As for Carpenters songs I have to give this some thought as there's much more to chose from. So, I do have to give this some thought also. I may have to take out my discs and give a listen for this one.
Though right off the bat I do have to mention "Baby It's You" from the "Close To You" album. It's funny that I would mention this one as I don't care for Richard's voice on portions of the backing vocals. But it's the arrangement of the vocals itself that I really like. With the "shay tay's" and the sustained notes. Karen and Richard's voices mix extremely well on this this song. In one channel you hear Karen's voice, the other Richard's and in the middle you hear both voices blended together. Beautiful arrangement beautiful vocals. Outstanding song. |
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Post by enigma on Dec 29, 2005 11:23:26 GMT -5
Well I am not a technical person so I will go with a few backing vocals that have stood out over the years. Some Carpenters songs that come to mind are "All Of My Life" "Crescent Noon" "Rainy Days and Mondays" "the Bacharach Medley" alot of the "Oldies Medley" "Please Mr Postman" "I have You" "Calling Occupants" "(I Want You) Back In My Life Again" and so many more. These are just the songs that have really caught my attention from th harmony vocal point of view they are different and seem to stand out for me as opposed to the usual great harmonies the Carpenters did. As for the solo record "If I Had You" is definately a standout and I also like the harmonies on "Making Love In The Afternoon" Peter Ceteras harmonies make this song rather unique on the record and he harmonizes so well with Karen I just love his harmonies on this song it a big part of what attracted me to the song.  |
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Post by Rick Henry on Dec 30, 2005 10:22:54 GMT -5
Well I am not a technical person so I will go with a few backing vocals that have stood out over the years. Some Carpenters songs that come to mind are "All Of My Life" "Crescent Noon" "Rainy Days and Mondays" "the Bacharach Medley" alot of the "Oldies Medley" "Please Mr Postman" "I have You" "Calling Occupants" "(I Want You) Back In My Life Again" and so many more. These are just the songs that have really caught my attention from th harmony vocal point of view they are different and seem to stand out for me as opposed to the usual great harmonies the Carpenters did. As for the solo record "If I Had You" is definately a standout and I also like the harmonies on "Making Love In The Afternoon" Peter Ceteras harmonies make this song rather unique on the record and he harmonizes so well with Karen I just love his harmonies on this song it a big part of what attracted me to the song. Excellent choices Enigma. Several you've named are on my list also.
Crescent Noon - this is a great song all the way around. Though the backing vocals are absolutely haunting. They are very intricate and add to the mystery and darkness of this song.
I Have You - absolutely lovely the way Karen's voice is double tracked. Very effective.
Only Yesterday - they outdid themselves with the vocals on this one. All the vocals are pieced together perfectly. In parts it's amazing how the backing vocals work their way into becoming the lead vocal. This is one of Richard's best works - it shoulda got a Grammy nomination.
More to come... |
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Post by GoodOldDreams on Dec 31, 2005 15:45:21 GMT -5
What a great topic!
The lush harmonies are a signature element of the Carpenters' "sound," so there are many songs --- almost too numerous to mention --- that appeal to me in this respect.
Some specific examples of the most outstanding backing and harmony vocals in the Carpenters' repertory for me include:
Nowadays Clancy Can't Even Sing - The rich fat chord on the word "Sing..." is a great musical hook in and of itself.
Maybe It's You - The burst of harmonies at "... rising on the shores the ocean came ... walks along the waves of velveteen" effectively paints an image of gigantic waves breaking and crashing upon the rocks along a beach and the picturesque ebb and flow of the chorus throughout the song.
Reason to Believe - I especially like how the harmonies in the phrase "someone like you makes it easy to give..." seem to answer in tonal counterpoint to the previous phrase "someone like you makes it hard to live with without someone else ..."
Baby It's You - Nice layering effect of vocals throughout the song, finishing with a tuneful wail "wah sha la la la la la la whoo ..."
I'll Never Fall in Love Again - Layers of vocal harmonies of "here to remind you" build up to a spectacular crescendo.
Sing - The Carpenters' voices harmonize gloriously with those of the Jimmy Joyce Children's Choir in the fourth verse.
Medley: Sing / Knowing When to Leave / Make It Easy on Yourself / Someday / We've Only Just Begun - Chillingly exquisite harmonies for the special "Music, Music, Music."
Without a Song - Full, rich vocal harmonies that shine on their own even without any instrumental accompaniment.
Your Baby Doesn't Love You Anymore - Rousing buildup to "Your baby doesn't love you anymore ... GIVE IT UP."
If I Had You - A well-executed creative and technical surprise with the complex harmonies answering to each other.
Finally and not the least are "Close to You" and "We've Only Just Begun," the songs that made the listening public first perk up and take notice of the Carpenters. If they didn't know better already, the thick, rich harmonies made some people think originally that the Carpenters were a large singing group!
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Post by DR Drummer on Dec 31, 2005 21:23:52 GMT -5
  Wow, great topic as I really enjoy the captivating, ionospheric harmonies they managed to awesomely create. This is what I refer to as their Sonic Rainbow. There are so many and starting right from their first album. "Nowadays Clancy Can't Even Sing" gives me a major chill factor for its full, complex, layered vocals and it's pretty challenging on the drums I might add. Obviously "We've Only Just Begun" and "Close to You" are timeless Carpenters harmonic signature classics. "Crescent Noon" is another absolute beauty with Karen's awesome voice mixing with the deep refrain harmonies. "All I Can Do" is such a beautiful, unique song and its vocals are hypnotic. I only wish it was a little longer. "For All We Know" has incredibly deep, harmonic refrains that blend so well with the breath taking music orchestration. What a beautiful song that should have made number 1 on the charts. "It's Going to Take Some Time" is very sweet and clever with its vocal layout. What a great flute solo interlude too "The Night Has a Thousand Eyes" really hits home with me with its colorful backing refrain vocals and harmonies. "Only Yesterday" musically illustrates how the Carpenters full rich choral sounds was taken to new heights. This song is practically musically indescribable. "Happy" is equally so as I really love this song and it could have easily made the top 10 on the US Billboard charts. There's certainly more songs as The Carpenters (tan album) is loaded with great vocals and harmonies. I don't own Karen's 1979 solo album but I have 8 solo extra songs from those sessions that are real neat.
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Post by cam83 on Dec 31, 2005 22:44:25 GMT -5
By the way, the lyrics...are "The ocean came...walks along the waves of velveteen..." from MAYBE IT'S YOU.
Cam
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Post by GoodOldDreams on Dec 31, 2005 22:52:39 GMT -5
Thanks Cam!
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Post by smoothie2 on Jan 1, 2006 0:29:17 GMT -5
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Post by cam83 on Jan 1, 2006 0:52:14 GMT -5
By the way, MAYBE IT'S YOU is a stunningly gorgeous song. I love also the word DIE in Your Baby Doesn't Love You Anymore. I think VOICE OF THE HEART features some wonderful styles, and backing harmonies, considering Karen was not on all of them...and they give you a hint of what could have been...I also find that TRYING TO GET THE FEELING AGAIN is wonderful...and love that they double tracked her lead vocal...and gave it a shimmering effect...along with Richard adding his layers of vocal harmonies...IF I HAD YOU is a stellar song with explosions of vocal overdubs mixed into the song...just pure genius...I also adore the background vocals for DON'T TRY TO WIN ME BACK AGAIN...Karen sounds lovely hitting those high notes...with comparable ease...like a baby eagle that soars for it's first time...just like Karen's voice...finding such a joy in singing and hitting the notes with 100 percent accuracy...
Cam
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Post by Rick Henry on Jan 1, 2006 2:10:58 GMT -5
By the way, MAYBE IT'S YOU is a stunningly gorgeous song. I love also the word DIE in Your Baby Doesn't Love You Anymore. I think VOICE OF THE HEART features some wonderful styles, and backing harmonies, considering Karen was not on all of them...and they give you a hint of what could have been...I also find that TRYING TO GET THE FEELING AGAIN is wonderful...and love that they double tracked her lead vocal...and gave it a shimmering effect...along with Richard adding his layers of vocal harmonies...IF I HAD YOU is a stellar song with explosions of vocal overdubs mixed into the song...just pure genius...I also adore the background vocals for DON'T TRY TO WIN ME BACK AGAIN...Karen sounds lovely hitting those high notes...with comparable ease...like a baby eagle that soars for it's first time...just like Karen's voice...finding such a joy in singing and hitting the notes with 100 percent accuracy... Cam Nicely written Cam and some good choices also. I agree with what you said about Karen's unreleased solo track "Don't Try To Win Me Back Again". The dubbed vocal harmonies are outstanding on this song. Karen once again proves her versatility with this song. Too bad the nine (or anyway nine that we know of there could be more) unreleased Karen solo songs have not been officially released. I would love to hear finished versions of these songs.
From "Voice Of The Heart" I really like the vocal mix on "Prime Time Love". It's a lesser mentioned song but I still like it. Richard comes in on the vocals backing Karen.
GoodOldDreams and DR Drummer both mentioned "Nowadays Clancy Can't Even Sing". You guys are right on in bringing this one up. Carpenters were so cutting edge in their arrangement both musically and vocally on this song. The vocals are outstanding with Karen blending right into Richard's lead vocal. It's Karen's harmony vocal that make the song for me. I love the part where Richard sings, "who's comin' home on old nine to five," and then Karen harmonizes in the background singing, "who's comin' home". What a great song. Definitely ahead of it's time.
"Johnny angel" from the "Oldies Medley" on the "Now And Then" album is quite splendid. I love the multi-harmony in the opening vocal. Karen sounds absolutely beautiful. DR Drummer mentioned "The Night Has A Thousand Eyes" - yes another example of outstanding backing and harmony vocals.
"All I Can Do" with it's "ba-ba-ahh-ba-ba-ahh" vocal this quirky song stands out as an unusual gem in both it's vocal mix and odd time signature.
"Two Sides" from the album "Passage" is one of my personal favorites. I love Karen's doubled tracked vocal.
DR Drummer also mentioned "Happy" as with everything on "Horizon" the vocal mix on "Happy" really stands out. I love the chorus where Karen sings "falling in love, falling in love with you, falling in love falling in love with you". The vocals are blended to absolute perfection.
I also think the mix of "Lovelines" on Karen's solo album is excellent. Rod Temperton surely knew how to bring out a different and uniquely wonderful side of Karen's voice. I just love the sunshiny sort of harmony and baking vocals which fade to the end of the song. |
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Post by smoothie2 on Jan 3, 2006 0:30:37 GMT -5
???I just wanted to add Make it Easy on Yourself as another one which I just realize how great R. and K. does on the harmony of it. It has kind of a "doo-wop" effect when it gets to the part which I'll describe as jumpy ..."and if this is good-bye, then you'll know it will make me cry" they sing...good-bye like "good-b...why" slight pause...then a softer slightly lower tone..."then you'll know it will make me "cr..why" I'm sure I haven't got the lyrics exactly right...but you all know what I mean (i hope) I just love the way they perform it with I think with a big orchestra...and everyone is dressed in tuxedos.. Even Karen. I believe it was one of their tv specials...in 1980... gee the first time i watched Karen on that the way she looks directly into the camera....and the great emotion she puts into it...gee seems she just has jumped off the screen and is staring right at me! Got chill bumps...!  My what a wonderful talent both she and Richard were! |
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Post by JIM on Jan 18, 2006 17:38:19 GMT -5
Welcome Dr. Drummer I love your analogy of the Carpenters backing vocals, they are truely nothing short of a sonic rainbow and I must agree with you that Only Yesterday was there ultimate achievement in multitracking. Every element of that tune compliments the other, from Karens lead to the cow bell. I listen to this song more than any other. Enigma Tim and Rick If I Had You is also just beyond words when it comes to Karens layered vocals. I wrote to Phil Ramone to ask how all these voices were woven together so presicely to produce such an interesting, complex vocal effect but no reply. What I find interesting is that both Karen and Richard had a unique charachter to there voices that blended with perfection when recording together or alone, as is so evident on there solo projects. Also there layering has a signature tone that is recognized instantly. When I first saw this post few days ago, I wanted to relocate where I read what song contains the most layered voices, I am almost sure its one of the songs in the Bacharach Medley. If any one knows, please tell me before I go mad. One interesting piece of info I read during my search was from the Karenanrichardcarpenter.com site In a technichal question about multitracking Richard goes into detail about how there layering styles changed from ping ponging to vocal doubling, as they could complete more tracks faster using a doubler. However he said they would always take the time to listen to there original harmonies before continuing with doubling to 4 part. Its an interesting read at Fans Ask. I have mentioned in post in the past its really interesting to put on head phones and using the many sound modes found on stereo and recording systems which allow the backing vocals to take on a new dimension, allowing you to hear the backing tracks in a totally new way. This could be personal bias but when I listen to the Carpenters, because the music is so well crafted I never fail to hear something new each time, even after 20+ years of listening to these songs! Pure Genius. Jim
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Post by cam83 on Jan 18, 2006 22:45:18 GMT -5
on the Close To You Album, there is a 39 voices on the I'LL NEVER FALL IN LOVE AGAIN track.
That is the one, that blew me away, and made me buy the CLOSE TO YOU studio album...as I was interested to hear what that would sound like. I was NOT disappointed.
Cam
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Post by Rick Henry on Jan 19, 2006 2:47:16 GMT -5
Welcome Dr. Drummer I love your analogy of the Carpenters backing vocals, they are truely nothing short of a sonic rainbow and I must agree with you that Only Yesterday was there ultimate achievement in multitracking. Every element of that tune compliments the other, from Karens lead to the cow bell. I listen to this song more than any other. Enigma Tim and Rick If I Had You is also just beyond words when it comes to Karens layered vocals. I wrote to Phil Ramone to ask how all these voices were woven together so presicely to produce such an interesting, complex vocal effect but no reply. Jim Jim, I really like the description "Sonic Rainbow" - that's exactly what the Carpenters vocals are like.
It would be interesting to hear about the vocal mix on "If I Had You". The one to get the scoop on that song would be Rod Temperton as he wrote the vocal arrangement. He was outstanding in his mixing of vocals. If you listen to Heatwave's "Central Heating" album you can hear alot of the same vocal techniques used on Karen's solo album. |
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