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Post by Rick Henry on Aug 11, 2006 9:14:19 GMT -5
Were any of the Vegas shows filmed Rick? According to a statement Richard made (I believe it was in the Ray Coleman book), every show they ever did was filmed.
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Post by wisejester7 on Aug 11, 2006 13:12:50 GMT -5
I wish Richard would release the material he's sitting on. Just think of the hours of enjoyment we could all share in.
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Post by Prisoner_Walking on Aug 12, 2006 18:17:31 GMT -5
I agree wisejester7. But did you hear that interview with Richard from only 3 months ago in which he said that he regrets releasing ANY out-takes? - he says he feels that they were out-takes for a reason and should have remained unheard, so I doubt there will be anything 'new' released again. Just imagine if he'd been of this opinion just after Karen died....we would never have heard ANYTHING after the 'Made In America' album - just think of all that music on 'Voice Of The Heart', 'Lovelines', 'As Time Goes By', not to mention 'Tryin to Get The Feelin' & Karen's solo album we would have missed out on!?
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Post by YesterdayOnceMore on Aug 12, 2006 20:36:18 GMT -5
Leo, you make a valid point - and I think you're probably exactly right. It took me a very long time to find that there was a whole series of tunes that were "available" if you will, from Karen's solo CD, those "unfinished" songs.....and I finally got a copy of them...but if Richard had thought this way just after Karen died, we may have missed out on lots of things we now do know about....including Karen's solo CD.....yikes. And so it makes me think there's a lot more out there that we know nothing about, NOR will we ever. Doesn't Richard know how much we want to hear these things, not CARING if they're perfect? Hasn't he heard about imperfection??? And that imperfection is okay? We don't expect it to be perfect, anyway......I mean, if they were still in the studio, I would expect it to be pretty close - but this is all stuff done long, long ago. We would just like to hear it because it's something Karen and Richard did, that we haven't heard before. I doubt it will ever happen, though. And, we're the losers for him thinking that way. Tim
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Post by wisejester7 on Aug 12, 2006 22:46:56 GMT -5
Prisoner-Walking(Leo) and YesterdayOnceMore(Tim) both have valid points. I'm very happy Richard has released those things that he has(even if he regrets it now), but I know there is more. I know K and R strived for perfection, but I think we would take it as 'works no longer in progress' if Richard would release other fruits of their labors. It's sad to know that not only is the world deprived of Karen and Carpenters prematurely, but that we are also deprived of recordings, pictures, film, etc. that exist in some vault that any fan would cherish.
-wisejester7
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Post by Rick Henry on Aug 12, 2006 23:33:46 GMT -5
I agree with what all have said. If Richard were to have never released any of these works we would never know gems such as; "Look To Your Dreams", "Prime Time Love", "The Rainbow Connection", "Leave Yesterday Behind", "Tryin' To Get The Feelin' Again", "If I Had You", "Guess I Just Lost My Head", "Saling On The Tide", "Ordinary Fool", "Honolulu City Lights", "You're The One", "Now" and many others.
I guess we are our own worst critic. But I don't understand why Richard regrets having released these songs - they have in no way tarnished Carpenters' legacy - actually these songs have enriched the Carpenters' legacy greatly. A Carpenters outake is just as good (if not better) than other artists completed works. There is nothing to be ashamed of in these outakes. They are fantastic. It would be sad if we never had the opportunity to hear these gems. I feel there have to be atleast another half dozen or more songs that are up to the caliber of "Tryin' To Get The..." or "Ordinary Fool". What about Palma's "Box Office Movie King" - I would love to hear Karen singing this one someday. There are probably about another 30-40 songs from various years as far back as 1967 which we haven't heard.
Now for Richard stating there will not be anymore releases - well that's another story. Richard is almost like the Who, in that the Who retired from touring several times and yet each time after they announced retirement they ended doing another tour - this happened about four or five times. After "Voice Of The Heart" was released Richard said there would be no more new Carpenters albums. Six years later came "Lovelines" - with this release he announced this would be the last - and this statement was in many newspaper interviews. Then six years after that comes "Tryin' To Get..." and then Karen's solo album. In 2001 the world received "As Time Goes By" - I think there's yet one more for us. That's just my wishful thinking.
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Post by Prisoner_Walking on Aug 13, 2006 5:33:26 GMT -5
Hey Guys, I often think about this. I know there is a list on the net somewhere called "Carpenters Hidden Gems" - which lists all the songs archived by Karen and Rich - I believe there are over 100, some of which we have heard on the 4 albums released since Karen's death. You guys have more than likely seen it.
I really am in two minds on this. On the one hand I agree with Richard that out-takes are out-takes for reasons - even if that reason is simply because you personally don't like the feel of the track regardless of how well it is performed. I know that I hate people hearing my songs when I am not personally happy with them...and with respect to guide vocals, no matter how good Karen was, you can TELL which songs are guide vocals because Karen doesn't put her all into them.
But on the other hand, we are STARVING for more of Karen's voice - as much as we cherish the old songs - something new and fresh to our ears would be amazing - even Karen's guide vocals would be something!
Having said that, I think Rich also said in the interview that there are no more tracks with complete vocals from Karen. And also think about it from a record company perspective...if they did not think there was anything left, they wouldn't fund it.
Anyway, I guess Rich just feels that they have scraped the barrell as much as they can and it's time to move on....
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Dave
Ultra Emissary
"sleeping in the arms of the cosmos..."
Posts: 1,515
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Post by Dave on Aug 13, 2006 6:43:26 GMT -5
"...there are no more tracks with complete vocals from Karen."
I think that statement pretty much sums up why there won't be anything else. But you know, Richard is a bit of a perfectionist, and there are more than a few complete bootleg tracks floating around out there. A few years ago, I whimsically suggested that perhaps Richard could gather up these tracks, polish them a bit, and package them in a CD titled "Carpenters At Work". The album cover would feature K&R Photoshopped into a construction site setting, complete with tools and yellow tape! Like the alternate ending to Robin Williams' "What Dreams May Come", the disc would come with a "warning" that the tracks contained within were as originally recorded, and may contain a few "cracks", "knotholes", and "splinters". But as I said, Richard would never think as I do, because it's his legacy. But you can only chase the illusion of "perfection" so far. Kenny Chesney once said that he never worries about perfection, he just throws it out there and the fans will let him know if it's good or not. However, I can't see Richard living on a tropical island and embracing the island life. He just doesn't come across as a flowered shirt/flip-flop kinda guy to me. Maybe he should try it sometime...? Maybe the time is right, though. I've noticed in recent years that almost every Christmas song they recorded is being played, where once "Merry Christmas Darling" was the only one. But Richard is happy doing what he's doing, and that's OK. He says that releasing a new album every 10 years is his "pattern", but after everything that has happened, performing with his family once a year at CPAC is good enough for me. Staying home and taking care of his family is the most important thing in the world.
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Post by wisejester7 on Aug 13, 2006 7:38:59 GMT -5
Unfinished works of the Carpenters and from Karen's solo efforts could be made into a learning tool. Richard could put liner notes explaining what is still missing from the pieces or how they would have re-worked things before they thought it was suitable for release.
I think there would be more than just a passing interest in having such an insight into what they did from 'start' to 'finish' on each song that was chosen for a track.
Just a thought.
;-)wisejester7
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Post by Prisoner_Walking on Aug 13, 2006 9:44:47 GMT -5
Sounds like a great idea wisejester - although sadly I just don't think the record company would see a half finished album as profitable or indeed marketable. I guess only Richard knows if any of the unreleased stuff is worth spending time and money on....maybe there really is not enough lead vocal to patch together a song...who knows? I think the best we can hope for now is some occasional remixes....
Anyway, imagine he did release some 'new' stuff and it really was half finished or [heaven forbid] not up to scratch performance-wise, I think deep down we would feel a little disappointed wouldn't we?
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Post by Rick Henry on Aug 13, 2006 10:29:52 GMT -5
In actuality there are several songs with sufficient almost completed vocal tracks from Karen. I can name three; "Box Office Movie King" (1976), "Thank You For The Music" (studio version - 1978-79) and "Dancing In The Street" (full length studio recording - 1978-79). And there have to be others lurking around.
It also seems that there must be atleast another one or two songs left over from each studio album dating back to the first 1969 release of "Offering". With nine studio albums that would amount to something like 14 to 18 songs that must be close to completion. Of course this is speculation - but I don't think my speculation is too far off the mark.
I have a feeling that Richard is sitting on a good amount more of music than he is letting on to. I don't know why he would tell us there isn't anything left and then go ahead and release an album with all previously unreleased music - he's done that about three times now.
We'll see what happens... I'd really like to hear those full length studio recordings of "Thank You For The Music" and "Dancing In The Street" which were recorded in mid to late 1978.
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Post by centurycity on Aug 13, 2006 16:13:08 GMT -5
I would like to say that I have the multi coloured swop shop on video not the best copy but its cool - I also have the different cuts for the chocolate advert done in japan makes me laugh becuase the box of choccies looks a little like a pack of cigs to start with.....
Song goes like this - from the heart comes the soul from the love there comes a child from the heart and the soul and so on and so fourth
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Post by wisejester7 on Aug 18, 2006 12:05:33 GMT -5
Songs I Wished They Sang OR Pairings With Other Artists
I wish Karen/Carpenters would have sung a duet with Barry Manilow..like 'Somewhere In The Night'.
;-)wisejester7
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Post by wisejester7 on Aug 18, 2006 12:06:43 GMT -5
Another pairing could be with her good friend ONJ
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Post by Rick Henry on Dec 23, 2006 11:04:11 GMT -5
Although as of late I have acquired several items which were on my wish list I have a new one which I would love very much. This would be an official release of Karen's drum medley which many of us call the "Strike Up The Band Medley". I do have a recording of it on the "Live At The Palladium" CD and I also have a copy of it from the "Spcae Encounters" TV special. but what I would like is a nice crisp clear release of her drum medley with all the talking and applause taken out. I would just love to hear this without any interruptions.
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Post by beaner on Dec 27, 2006 9:07:20 GMT -5
I was just thinking...can you imagine if Karen and Tom had a child that this child would be in their 20's right now and it would have been such a wonderful thing to watch as Karen and her son/daughter performed a song together. What a truly joy that would have been. By the way, did anyone get a chance to go to the annual "Top of the World" event this year? Richard was going to sing with his daughter, Mindi. Just curious. I go on www.youtube.com a lot and try to see if anyone has any video footage of the Carpenter Center but as yet have not been able to find any. I like that site a lot. So much footage I've never seen before of Karen and Richard, etc. HAPPY NEW YEAR to everyone!
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